White collar workers, do you think that it’s your fault if you don’t get a REM rate raise?

[lme]

I was having a chat with a colleague about our pay rise this year. I got a decent one and she didn’t. So I asked her if she pushed for it? As in made notes of what she has done and discuss it with her manager to then leverage a raise. She said no and said that it’s done through her KPIs.

I wasn’t sure what to say after that - but I really feel that we as employees should push/ask for raise/ let the manager know that we want to be valued. I feel a lot of my female colleague don’t push for this then complain that they only get the bare minimum…

Is that a thing or am I over reaching?

 

[resjudicata]

@lme I was listening to a podcast a few weeks ago about a US based tech firm that the guy had been hired at.

He was there for 3 weeks when his boss popped his head in the door and said “Congrats, you just got a pay raise”.

Turns out the firm has a policy that if someone comes in and negotiates a higher starting salary for the position - everyone gets bumped up.

 

[lme]

@resjudicata That’s so great actually. I wish it’s the same here so that we all feel appreciated and maybe the slackers can work harder haha jokes

 

[willow_the_seagull]

@lme You're not wrong. Whilst it's a great idea, the pay should be stepped, if you're a slacker you get 1 step, if you work for it, you get 2. That's how some businesses I know operate and it works.

 

[morganlee]

@lme I've never had to do this

And as a manager I see my people as assets and wouldn't expect them to have to convince me of what they've done. I should know.

And while I think kpis are overutilized/overly trying to stick a number on EVERYTHING I do think your coworker is somewhat correct. If the organization states that's how people are evaluated then that's how they should be evaluated for compensation.

 

[shekinahglory15]

@morganlee I agree that KPIs are basically a blunt force instrument for measuring an employees performance. What KPIs are good for is giving the employee a roadmap for promotion, pay rise, bonus efc. Focus on the things the company measures, if they don't measure it they either dont care about it (doesn't generate profits) or it's too difficult to easily measure therefore easy to bluff/fake.

Far too often I see people focus on aspects of their job that are a waste of time as far as pay review/company progression is concerned and then they complain they don't get pay rises.

 

[lme]

@shekinahglory15 Could you give me some examples of wasting time? Asking this truthfully as I would like to keep on track and be successful in my field.

 

[shekinahglory15]

@lme The answer to that question is very dependant on your career and employer. As an example, if you are a sales rep and your company measures you on % of leads converted, dollars per sale and profit margin per sale. % converted measure does not take into account repeat business (clearly this is a poorly designed KPI) so if you spent time building relationships and generating repeat customers this is a good result for the company but a waste of time as far as your KPIs are concerned.

You could spend more of your own time to justify why your work is valuable to the company and explain the logic as to why you deserve bonus/pay rise etc. and good company/manager would agreed. Alternately you could just play the game by their rules, look good on paper, which is all the higher ups see and enjoy your comfy ride up the corporate ladder.

 

[lme]

@shekinahglory15 Thanks for this. I will make note of this

 

[sprstudios]

@lme There is a chapter in the Barefoot investor that talks about this. Most people don't really do any work to prepare for their reviews. They expect their boss to know that they have worked hard and deserve a raise.

The TLDR of the chapter was to treat the review like an interview, prepare for it. Take in talking points and evidence of your work, show management that you are serious about what you do and where you want to be. Don't phone it in.

 

[lme]

@sprstudios Yup I think even just putting the effort in shows the manager that you try. And even if they can’t give u a raise now they will note it for the next chance.

 

[holeyhermit]

@lme This could be a gender subconscious bias playing into account here

Men are generally going to be more forward and push for pay increases, while women generally tend to be more passive about things.

Obviously, not in all cases, I’ve learned to be more active in pursuing things from my American wife. But in general, there are gender differences about how men and women approach reviews and rem packages.

But yes, it’s a case of “don’t ask, don’t get”, if you want something you need to push for it. If you think you’re an excellent worker, come armed with ammo at REM time, don’t expect it to fall in your lap.

 

[hanna123]

@holeyhermit In my experience as a manager it’s actually been the exact opposite. Men tend to try to be stoic and accepting. Woman are more likely to have done their research and ask for more pay. Small sample size (I’ve probably managed 200 people over my career thus far) but really noticeable trend.

 

[maillig85]

@hanna123 That’s awesome to hear that it’s changing

 

[hanna123]

@maillig85 I’d like to think so but may be just a statistical anomaly!

 

[lme]

@holeyhermit This is my thought exactly.. I think females don’t push as hard and being one myself, well actually I was reluctant to bring it up as to not come off as I’m only keen on money to my manager, cause I love my job. But my partner pushed and told me that there are KPIs but nothing wrong will me nudging with documentation of what I have achieved for the company to help me back up what I say. I did it this year and got a really good raise. My boss even applauded me for being on to it and pulling together the packaged on the side of having written my KPIs in system.

 

[tstor]

@lme My husband is really good at pushing me to do stuff like this. I think it’s particularly hard being female since if I were to say verbatim the things my husband gets away with saying I’d be viewed as a difficult bitch and unpleasant to work with. From a tall white dude it comes across as being assertive and having leadership potential.

 

[dacoata]

@lme I worked in a company under kpi based wages rises, and I liked and hate them.
I like them because it made me feel everyone puts in there fair share of hard work and your wages reflect that. I hate that is not transparent on wages that I actually don’t really know what I’m worth.

I now work in a role under PSA and it’s paid on degrees etc not work ethics. Under this I hate how I have an extremely good employee go above expectation and one below but they are on the same wage no bonus nothing.

 

[resjudicata]

@lme End of the day, you go to work to earn money, gotta look out for numero uno at the best and worst of times. Too many people don't value themselves as much as the company (secretly) does or needs them. I bet theres at least a dozen high up managers or senior roles here where if you's didn't turn up to work that company would be fucked, if you are in one of those positions, you sure as shit better push for pay rises.

 

[resjudicata]

@lme My experience is that my female clients negotiate badly, until they don't care about the relationship anymore. Then they negotiate like tigers.