Thoughts on a 10M salary in Semicon in Nagoya

[passiflora]

Hi all,

I’m in the process of deciding to take a job offer in Japan (Nagoya) in the semiconductor industry. The company offered me a base salary of around 8.5M yen and a 1.5M yen bonus, bonus could turn out higher or a bit lower depending on performance. 1.5M is the default bonus. They also offer a housing allowance, but it is only 80k yen a month for the first year and 40k for the second year.

I am 33M, with 6 years of semiconductor industry experience and a Master’s degree. I speak basically no Japanese.

Do you think this is a fair offer or does Japan usually pay more in the semiconductor industry?

Also, at this moment they are not willing to pay international school for my 4 year old, which is a disappointment for me. International school is usually 1-1.5M a year in Nagoya.

If you have any experiences or thoughts, please share.

 

[robertthebruce]

@passiflora Japan is a great place to live. Not sure where you’re from or if this is your first job in the country, but having lived in Japan for 9 years now, I’d say the pay is pretty decent. Most jobs in Japan pay nowhere near that amount. You’ll have a very comfortable lifestyle. I’m guessing your wife is not Japanese?

 

[passiflora]

@robertthebruce No, she is not, but she is able to speak Japanese. Yes, it will be my first job in Japan and I am in The Netherlands now.

 

[robertthebruce]

@passiflora I see, the international school expenses are going to add up. But seeing how your family situation is, this would be for the best. There are lots of ways to make that money you’ll earn stretch out here. I think you guys will really enjoy the time you spend in Japan.

 

[christianterp23]

@passiflora Besides the fact that they speak English, international schools are not worth it. They don’t necessarily have better quality of education. Kids come and go and it’s really hard to make life long friendships. I went to international school. But that’s just my own opinion. People have different experiences and different opinions.

 

[passiflora]

@christianterp23 Ok. Thanks for your opinion. I cannot judge the quality part, I think it depends to which Japanese school I’d have to compare it to.

 

[toni123]

@passiflora Are you at ASML now? The chip lithography in Japan is not going to match that tech but there’s a lot of geopolitical forces pushing chip manufacturing away from Taiwan into Japan. If you’re in the low-level lithography and imaging side, you’d do quite well here, I think. But if you’re already at ASML, it’s hard to beat the (current) state of the art.

 

[paleouss]

@toni123 While ASML is without a doubt the leader in lithography, in Japan, I don't know of any EUV lithography machines being installed here. Kioxia's 3DNAND flash doesn't need EUV and I haven't heard of Micron in Hiroshima using EUV either.

Rapidus claims to be doing 2nm tech which would probably require EUV but that seems very iffy.

 

[passiflora]

@paleouss Indeed, Kioxia and Micron are not using EUV, but I’m also not in EUV at the moment. I know the rumors, but can’t disclose them here

 

[trinity101]

@paleouss The EUV line was going in in Hiroshima as of pre COVID. Haven't checked in with Micron recently about their plans and their chief lithographer has retired so I'm not sure who to ask anymore.

 

[paleouss]

@trinity101 Rumor was, EUV would have used so much electricity to the point of overloading the power grid. While Micron requested for an upgrade to their power systems, it was rejected by the local government due to environmental concerns.

This was like 5 years ago. I don't know if things have changed since.

 

[trinity101]

@paleouss Yeah when I was actively working on EUV back 20+ years ago (yes, it was supposed to be in production in 2009. TSMC got it working last year) we calculated we would need a nuclear power plant next to every fab because the conversion ratio was so low between power in and photons out. The stuff Cymer has been doing is amazing (but jesus christ have you seen the size of that fucking laser? a 2 story laser tube for each scanner - yowser) although I still dislike vaporizing Sn inside my clean scanner. Never mind the whole pellicle problem, that we now need multiple exposures per layer and OPC (getting rid of those was considered the advantage of going to EUV - don't get me started on reverse/computational litho - I love it but that is some funky assed shit to capture 2nd and 3rd order diffraction coefficients), or the funky 4 by 8x they are talking about for high NA, and the shadow effect from the off axis illumination... I still think we (as an industry) did a real disservice to Nikon back in 2003ish when IBM and Intel both came out saying they weren't interested in EPL which Nikon had a working machine they were willing to give Sematech to put into one of their sites (can't remember if it was Austin or Albany) and it was vetoed and the project was basically killed...

Nowadays keeping up with EUV is just a hobby - nice to see what I put so many years of my life into finally becoming a reality.

 

[elohim3161]

@trinity101 It's going in. Was confirmed in the last couple of weeks.

 

[passiflora]

@toni123 Yes, I’m at ASML. I think it would be difficult to move to another company in semicon or any other company in Nagoya, because my lack of Japanese language skills.

 

[ethzz]

@passiflora Elementary schools here are really pretty good, and even if you are not going to stay long term, perhaps you could consider a regular, local school, instead of international.

 

[passiflora]

@ethzz Yes, I’m willing to consider it. But I’m afraid everything will be in Japanese, the little only speaks English at this point.

 

[critter1991]

@passiflora Do public schools. A year of Kindergarten, and your daughter will be near native level. What a gift for a young human being!

 

[passiflora]

@critter1991 I like your way of thinking

 

[ethzz]

@passiflora I think I read in another post that your wife knows some japanese?

Also, being 4 means about two years until school, tho that depends on birthdays (it's been a while, but I think April 1st is a cutoff date--if 6 by then, then school; if not, then another year of daycare or something).

I'd agree with the other poster here (@radovan80-Earth-5815) that a year in kindergarten would just about do it for language skills. We know two kids that went to the states from here a little over a year ago, got there when 3 and 5, and they're doing really well now.

Sure, there are challenges, and I've seen it unfold a little differently for each of the kids that we know. If your child was older, maybe several years up in school, international might be in contention (personally). But at 4, it seems like this could be an opportunity.

 

[passiflora]

@ethzz Yeah, my wife lived in Japan before, so she can help with the language. I just don’t want to shock the little one too much. I appreciate the thoughts, maybe I was set too much on international school. It is hard for me to compare the two without any experience in that field.