Non-Residents, how did you move Y out of the country?

[narrowisthepath]

I have been a non-resident of Japan for some time now and have a sizable amount of cash, approximately 10 million yen, sitting in a bank account. I'm looking to move it out of the country for investment purposes. What's the best option for minimizing foreign exchange costs and fees? I read the wiki at https://japanfinance.github.io/handling/transfers/, and the fees mentioned there seem prohibitively expensive. I wonder if converting to USD through purchasing a USD ETF and then transferring to a US account (similar to Norbert's Gambit) could be a feasible solution. Is that possible?

 

[manishk012]

@narrowisthepath

I wonder if converting to USD through purchasing a USD ETF and then transferring to a US account (similar to Norbert's Gambit) could be a feasible solution. Is that possible?

None of the brokers in Japan will let you do this.

 

[narrowisthepath]

@manishk012 Which part? Selling USD ETF in USD or transferring to a foreign bank in USD?

 

[manishk012]

@narrowisthepath Transferring an ETF or really any security to an overseas broker is basically impossible.

 

[catqueen]

@manishk012 Should be fine if they use IBKRJ.

 

[facebookbrett44]

@narrowisthepath You can buy crypto (Bitcoin or an USD coin for example) on an japanese exchange like bitflyer. Transfer it to an exchange account of a country of your choice, sell your crypto there and withdraw the cash. Quick and depending on your exchange low fees.

 

[bossbro]

@facebookbrett44 Yeah this is a good way sure crypto is volatile but you can do this relatively quickly and not be faced with too much up and down. Tether and USD coin etc allow this to be practically zero if you don't want the volatility at all.

You will probably pay less fees/have less hassle than dealing with banks.

 

[detawar567]

@facebookbrett44 I have done it this way many times. Done with USDC there is zero carry risk.

IMO it's the best way by far for OP's situation - but they will need to spend a little bit of time opening an account on an exchange in each country, doing the KYC, and learning some basics to make the transfers safely. Can be done in a day or two.

 

[kristhuy]

@narrowisthepath As a non-resident, you will be subject to the highest level of AML scrutiny. Depending on your bank's policies, you may even be required to show up in-person to execute any kind of transfer or withdrawal. In any event, your first step should be to talk to your bank about your options.

 

[narrowisthepath]

@kristhuy They don't know that I'm not a resident; that's how I've kept my account open without them freezing all my assets.

 

[kristhuy]

@narrowisthepath I see. If you can't open any new Japanese accounts though, I don't think you have any options for getting the money out of the account other than via an international wire transfer, which will cost whatever your bank normally charges for such transfers. I suppose the other option would be to withdraw it in cash, but withdrawing such a large amount would be pretty risky.

 

[narrowisthepath]

@kristhuy What's my option of I can open new japanese accounts? I think I still got my residency on file there, I'd like to understand all my options.

 

[kristhuy]

@narrowisthepath If you're no longer a resident of Japan, you would have to commit obvious bank fraud to open an account and pass KYC/AML checks. In any event, you would still be looking at an international wire transfer—just with a bank cheaper than your current bank.

You've already seen a comparison of the various banks' fees and commissions in the wiki, so you know what the market looks like. There is no "one weird trick" that enables you to exchange JPY for USD without paying an exchange commission. And with respect to the amount you are describing, the exchange commission will be the largest expense associated with the transaction.

 

[bossbro]

@kristhuy Literally all he has to do is send some money using online banking slowly to wise in Yen (which he can open from abroad) not all in a giant transaction.

Then convert to USD in smaller chunks to reduce huge fees it doesn't get much better than that.

 

[kristhuy]

@bossbro

convert to USD in smaller chunks to reduce huge fees

Except that Wise's exchange commission is at least 3-6 times larger than most Japanese banks' exchange commission...

At the type of volume OP is describing, I can't think of a scenario in which Wise would be cheaper.

 

[ethzz]

@narrowisthepath One thing that may come up--have you got your My Number, and had that connected to the account?

 

[narrowisthepath]

@ethzz haven't got my number, I'm thinking I may have to fly back there just to get one

 

[kristhuy]

@narrowisthepath If you've lived in Japan since October 2015, you have a MyNumber already. If you haven't lived in Japan since October 2015, you can't get a MyNumber without moving your 住所 (base of your life, etc.) to Japan.

 

[jewelpet]

@narrowisthepath probably already considered but how about something like revolut. you can transfer yen and then swap to usd. only thing is that you will have to submit mynumber to be able to send overseas. But if you can invest via credit card. then you can just buy stuff via their card.

 

[firewithin]

@narrowisthepath Do it via crypto. Almost instant but be quick