Moving from Milan to Zürich

[johnstalling]

@caspet Super sad towns.

 

[caspet]

@johnstalling All three are better than living in Oerlikon.

 

[sunnyhope]

@johnstalling Lmfao ok 80k net is 40k net equivalent.

 

[johnstalling]

@sunnyhope Lmfao? Do you know ho Italian salaries work?

• 40k net in Milan .
• 90k brutto in ZH are 81k paid to your bank, 68k after taxes, 62k after krankenkasse.

Price indexe between ZH and Milan is around 50% higher in ZH (rent, going out, public transport).

I lived in ZH for 18 years and I had an apartment in Milan (I know Milan very well), the two amounts are comparable in quality of life in the two cities.

 

[sunnyhope]

@johnstalling No, the tax is max 10k not 13k, 6k health is only if you actually eat into the Franchise. And the 9k off of 90k are contributing to your pension that undoubtedly is better here. That leaves 65k easily.

Now let's use your math, if everything is 50% more, then if you spend 30k out of the 40k net in Milan, 30*1.5 = 45k. You are left with 20k savings instead of 10k.

 

[johnstalling]

@sunnyhope You are nitpicking... and even agreeing with all your points , who would go from Milan to Zurich for 10k more a year? Specially if you are form Milan. And you are manipulating all numbers on your side, like "no franchise, no health issues ever", "better pension", ...

My point stands. If you earn 40k in Milan and 90k in Zurich you are around the same salary. No need to move...

 

[sunnyhope]

@johnstalling I am not nit-picking, I am showing your analysis up for what it is - superficial. E.g. the fact that you ignore long term saving benefits speaks volumes.

10k turns into 20k soon, and compound interest will grow your retirement fund more and more.

 

[johnstalling]

@sunnyhope Ok I stop here, Reddit is full of too long dead horse beating discussions.

 

[zaphnatpanea]

@thims You are shooting your self in the foot when going for the absolute lowest price. Catching up with salary takes years, if at all possible within that company. Prices in CH are stable, and so is salary.

Think carefully before selling your self, are you not worth more? The budget is clearly there, I think you should ask for more. And Zurich is expensive. Maybe your new colleagues all make more than you for the exact same job. You won’t be happy, have some respect for your self and your worth. Otherwise you end up in the working poor class.

And you cannot compete only on a low salary, all those jobs are in India.

 

[primitivebaptist]

@thims If you live together with ur partner and normal expenses inculding holidays and a car, your saving rate can be 15k yearly with a 90k salary

 

[thedrgonzo]

@thims

By some calculations I think I’d spend around 5’000-6’000 just for living.

How are you getting to that number? Sounds like a lot. For one person, especially with a two person household (assuming gf also has an income).

1500 for rent is easily enough, so double that would be 3k. Even for in the city that is a lot.

Then 300 to 500 for health insurance. Only get the lowest 300 francs franchise (deductible) if you are expecting major health expenses this year. If youre a young healthy person with no medical issues, get the 2.5k deductible, save up 2.5k to pay it if needed. That way 300 is a more likely monthly healthcare bill, especially if you dont live in the city of zurich municipality (where costs are higher than in the countryside).

Then like 500-1000 is gonna be enough for groceries for two people per month.

Maybe 1k in taxes.

Thats line 3.5k max in fixed costs. How are you planning to spend all that rest? So obviously the how much you can save depends on how much you spend.

 

[thims]

@thedrgonzo I’d like to invest the 7’000 yearly allowance on the 3rd pillar, and the rest in my portfolio.

 

[thedrgonzo]

@thims If you are on a B permit, you get taxed at source. Unlike swiss citizens and those on a C permit. So you won't have to fill in a steuererklärung (filing taxes) for the first 5 years.

Because of this, if you live in kanton Zürich, you will be taxed an average tax rate from the whole canton. Not actually the one from your city. So if your town has higher taxes than the base rate of the canton (steuerfuss 100), you will actually pay more when filing taxes. Because then the effective rate of your town will be applied. Which might eat up all or most of your savings from paying into pillar 3a.

So for example if you live in the city of Zurich itself, it doesnt make financial sense to pay into 3a, instead of just investing it on your own.

I guess if your town has a lower than 100 tax rate, it would be double worth it to pay into 3a. Because you would get the savings from 3a and also the additional savings from switching to the average to your towns real rax rate.

So make sure to check what the tax rate (Steuerfuss) in your particular town is before paying into 3a. Because you might potentially generate a higher tax bill and also a bunch of additional work for yourself this way.

 

[nobark]

@thedrgonzo Even in ZH makes sense to do 3a with withholding tax. You’re getting back easily over 1k on 90k salary.
And if you do it smart (I.e finpension) there is basically no difference compared to VT