Degiro: Trying to understand how realized P/L is estimated

[kaytiedid]

I use Degiro and my fiat currency is "EUR". I had invested in some stock listed in Nasdaq in USD. I closed my positions and the reported numbers within the platform do not agree in some cases.

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Case 1 Stock A, numbers agree!

Based on the "account" tab (real numbers, all reported by Degiro in EUR):

• 252.70 (sell order, temporarily gain, estimated using XXX echange rate) - 0.51 (fee of sell order) - 293.32 (buy order, estimated using XXX echange rate) - 0.51 (buy order fee) -0.08 (ADR fee) = -41.72 euros loss.
• Degiro has estimated -41.71 euros loss as I can see in the «closed positions » section in the « portfolio » tab.
• I consider the values identical so everything fine here.

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Case 2 Stock B, numbers DO NOT agree!

Based on the "account" tab (2 sell orders & 2 buy orders):

146.4 (sell order gain, using XXX exchange rate)

+ 48.80 (sell order gain, using YYY exchange rate)

- 0.51 (fee of sell order)

- 143.96 (buy, using ZZZ exchange rate)

- 0.51 (fee for buy)

- 51.9 (buy, using WWW exchange rate)

- 0.50 (fee for buy)

= -2.18 euros.

• However, in my in the « closed positions » section in « portfolio » tab, this appears as a +0.52 euros gain.
• This cannot be correct in any case. The difference is huge.

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I contacted them and told me that this difference arises due to P/L of the currency. I do not understand this.

Their reply:

Please note that the fluctuations between the currencies also lead to a P/L. In your example, you are only converting the values to Euros. Since the position was denominated in USD and your base currency is EUR, this would mean you would go long on the US dollar. For this, please take into account the P/L of the EUR w.r.t US dollar.

For any positions denominated in a foreign currency, you should take into account the currency fluctuation

In my manual estimations, the amounts in euros are exactly as reported by degiro in my account section. So, it's the converted USD amount to EUR with the exact exchange rate of the transaction. So the exchange rate has been taken into consideration.

What am I missing here?

SOLVED

• It is indeed the dividends. I had received 3 in total and now after doing the math it makes sense.
• 2.69 euros from div -2.18 the loss = 0.52 gain

 

[amcillwain]

@kaytiedid I find errors like this quite often and don't know how to explain them either.

 

[kaytiedid]

@amcillwain I don’t know. I asked them and they said to take into account the P/L of the currency but it’s already accounted for no?

 

[amcillwain]

@kaytiedid Yes, the currency appreciation/depreciation is taken into account as long as you calculated the Euro value of the purchase and sale using the exchange rate at the date of each transaction (as opposed to using the same exchange rate for both the purchase and sale)

 

[kaytiedid]

@amcillwain This is what I did. My problem is solved see updated post!!!

 

[nishan]

@kaytiedid

In euros: 252.70 (sell order, temporarily gain) - 0.51 (fee of sell order) - 293.32 (buy order) - 0.51 (buy order fee) = -41.72 euros loss.

Those numbers give -41.64. Where did you get 41.72 from?

 

[samuelhayes]

@kaytiedid Are you using the exchange rate both at the time of buy and sell? Is the exchange rate the same for buying and selling currency or is there a spread?

 

[kaytiedid]

@samuelhayes I used the amounts that are reported in my account tab. All are in euros and the convention was done by Degiro using the appropriate exchange rates that are not the same for the buy and sell order.

Thus, to answer your question, no, the exchange rate of the buy order and the sell order are not the same. One is for example 0.826 for buy and 0.8XX for sell

 

[marcelo_burt_3223]

@kaytiedid Have you checked the numbers they shared via email when purchasing/selling the assets? I notice they are more accurate as they include FX conversion fees for example

 

[kaytiedid]

@marcelo_burt_3223 Yes, I have. The numbers in my example are identical to the ones in the emails. I am aware of the FX fee but this is integrated into the exchange rate that is reported in the "account" section. I have done the math and it's like that.

Going back to my example, when I buy shares they convert to EUR using the appropriate exchange rate. Same for my sell orders. Then the difference minus the fees is the P/L. In example 1 it's fine but in example 2 the values do not match at all.