$235k for family of 4 to live comfortably in top 100 biggest cities!

[popdave4011]

@chris0699 And here i am doing it on half that, lol.

 

[someorder2]

@chris0699 Our household income is half of that and we live in a VHCOL with a 3 person family and I feel very comfortable. I bought my house like 15 years ago, so I know that is significant, but $235k just seems kind of crazy as a minimum to be comfortable. I'm also pretty darn frugal.

 

[williamhob]

@someorder2 Housing is the single biggest cost, and the one that has gone the most out of control. Whether you bought a house more than 5 years ago or not will essentially determine your financial future unless housing majorly corrects. So if you were just a little to young to get into the housing game before 2019, you're effectively cooked

 

[mellie]

@chris0699 30% play money seems insane.

A family making 100k should spend $2500 a month on….what, exactly?

 

[jaylr]

@chris0699 We make about that with two kids. And I say we live comfortably. By that I mean we don’t have to worry about daily expenses and save both short and long term. Live in AZ but both work remote.

 

[marystokesq]

@chris0699 This “study” by SmartAsset truly bends my brain. As noted by others, it is basically taking MIT’s living wage calculator and doubling it. The problem? The highly subjective phrase “live comfortably.” Lifestyle choices vary widely, as do desire for travel, entertainment, eating out, shopping for wants/needs, etc. I’ve lived in Vegas for 30 years - I rarely go to any shows (unless I’m offered a free ticket) - because I’m just not interested in Strip entertainment. From the point of view of my colleagues who went to shows, to eat, and gambling every weekend, I probably looked broke. But we also took our family on multi-week vacations every year, and I’d hear all sorts of envious remarks (“gee, I wish we could afford to go to ______”). Different priorities, different budgets, different definitions of “comfort.”

Another problem? When you look at the Social Security wage statistics for 2022 (2023 won’t be available until later this year), 85% of all reported wages are under 100k, and only around 13% of reported wages are between 100k and 200k. So…who is making this so-called “comfortable” living anyways?

SmartAsset is a financial management company. This “study” is no more than a sales tool to drive traffic to their website and draw in potential customers by convincing people that they don’t make enough money to “live comfortably” (and I’m sure they offer tools to “build wealth”). I’m getting so tired of this manipulative BS.

 

[goat]

@chris0699 MIT makes a lot of assumptions and I don’t see the terms defined in the article. I’d call a 50/30/20 budget more than “comfortable”. At $235k, that’s almost $50k just for annual wants (lmao) and probably another $50k in savings, after one includes matches. That works out to over $6m after 35 years at 6% return, btw. So yes, very, very comfortable.

 

[eaglewings02]

@goat The wants is the 30% part so more like $70k annually. 6k/month I guess affords a lot of Taylor Swift tickets for your kids. Quite comfortable.

 

[livingphoenix]

@chris0699 These numbers are just silly fantasy.

 

[chrislovingston]

@chris0699 That is only necessary in a few big cities. Mine

I wish moving were easy but leaving family would make me miserable.

 

[jesusreigns4ever]

@chris0699 I don't know about other places but I live in Los Angeles, we have a HHI of about $220k, 2 kids (I have joint custody/50%, but I ALSO pay child support), I max retirement accounts, kids' 529 accounts, gf is younger and not as far along in her career but contributes to 401k and Roth as well, I drive a 2016 3 series thats paid off, she has a car payment on a VW beetle. We take a few vacations a year w the kids and a few trips for ourselves, live in a nice 2 + 2 in a good neighborhood, that we rent, and we don't wonder if we can afford to buy random stuff on amazon or go get sushi or whatever. We're somewhat 'comfortable' but I don't feel any better than just middle class. I can save and invest, can typically pay off any debt I take on pretty quick, I have about 10 months living expenses liquid, but buying a house is out of the question short of robbing a bank or winning the lottery so yeah. Basically stuck in the endless middle.

Edit: Come to think of it, it's 3 adults raising 2 kids since I didn't include my ex wife in that original equation and her household and income. Because of course there are camps, activities, sleepaway/summer camp(s), birthdays, clothes, existence... and they go to public school. private school out of the question.

Otherwise, when I see people in this sub try and refute articles like this, try and say that money referenced is 'upper class' or something and talk about how they support a fam of 4 on $68k in Kindling Pile, Missouri or something, I just chuckle...

 

[apmichael]

@chris0699 Guess I'll go against the grain and say it's not far off. Our expenses as a family of 4 with 2 in daycare YTD (3 months), in a city estimated at ~$210k gross in the study.

Needs:

Housing(rent) - $10,065

Kids(daycare/clothes/health) - $10,150

Food/diapers(mostly groceries) - $8,325

Utilities - $3,300

Auto - $1,600

Wants/other - $2,960

Comes out to ~$146k a year before even talking about "savings" in a 50/30/20 budget.

 

[ekta]

@apmichael Are those monthly numbers? How does that come out to 146k a year?

 

[apmichael]

@ekta Edited for clarity, my bad. Those are cumulative expenses for 3 months

 

[ubicaritas]

@apmichael Eh this still seems quite high (or at least far above what is necessary to be “comfortable). That comes out to $3300/month on rent and over $2700/month on food and diapers. As a household of 4 myself, we pay about half of that in rent ($1750) and about 1/3 of that on food ($900), and I live in one of the largest cities in the country. Overall, we spend about $60k/yr total.

With the numbers you are giving, I would sure hope you live in VHCOL city (as that would make some sense), but the $230k number provided in the article wasn’t just for VHCOL cities, it was for the top 100 largest cities, which covers many MCOL and LCOL cities.

 

[jennieflanagan]

@chris0699 Education, location, experience: the three tenants of solid job that leads to a middle class life these days. Yes, HS diploma holders can make $235k working hard labor jobs or in sales, but having a degree in a high demand field makes reaching the middle class a hell of a lot easier. Degree holders always do better on salary than non-degree holders, especially in STEM.

 

[mark1215]

@chris0699 You buying your house 10 years ago and a couple or young family buying a house now is likely a huge difference in mortgage payment and salary needed to live “comfortably.”

 

[fidem]

@mark1215 Bingo. These people claiming they can live comfortably cannot if they had to purchase a home at today's prices & rates. I make $160 & cant afford shit in my local housing market. Homes around me cost $1MM each, tell me how you make that payment with $100k/yr in income? You don't

 

[justtunji]

@chris0699 Washington state requires employers include salary ranges in job listings. Look up Seattle jobs for roles you’re familiar with and see what the salaries are like here in a very HCOL area. Might be interesting to compare apples to apples.

 

[stephenbagot]

@chris0699 Make 200k right now, Eastern Bay Area living, doing pretty good.